If it is so great, why does it have to be bailed out by welfare checks all the time to continue?

Edited: 04/01/2020 at 07:51 AM by HAPDigital

You could not be more wrong. This is corporate welfare. Socialism is wrong. Corporate welfare, too big to fail and jumpstart the economy are all acceptable.

-------------------------

"One of the reasons why propaganda tries to get you to hate government is because it's the one existing institution in which people can participate to some extent and constrain tyrannical unaccountable power." Noam Chomsky.

It would only be socialism if the public got something for their money, like an equity stake in the businesses we're paying to bail out.

Socialism would be highly effective in producing the PPE and medical equipment we actually need for the population at cost without the artificial scarcity and profit motives which capital markets demand.

Capitalism is immoral on it's face, but it's especially poor for dealing with crises which are difficult to monetize [climate change?]. Capitalism is people buying a truck load of hand sanitizer and selling it for absurd prices on Ebay. Socialism is the state of New York saying "we need this product for the safety of the people, and we're going to make it ourselves and distribute to those who need it".


-------------------------
Capitalism is based on the ridiculous notion that you can enjoy limitless growth in a closed, finite system.

In biology, such behavior of cells is called "cancer".

Edited: 04/01/2020 at 06:37 AM by RustyTruck

Fixed, good call. thanks

Your basic point though is correct, and that is that capitalism is inherently unstable and prone to cyclical collapse. The "invisible hand" of the "free market" will give you a bitch slap, especially if you'r on the labor side of the equation.

Liberalism was intended to stabilize it with safety nets and institutional controls, but capital has been winning the war and eroding those supports for 50 years with the tacit cooperation of right leaning neo-liberals.

-------------------------
Capitalism is based on the ridiculous notion that you can enjoy limitless growth in a closed, finite system.

In biology, such behavior of cells is called "cancer".

It would only be socialism if the public got something for their money, like an equity stake in the businesses we're paying to bail out.

Many receive pay far beyond what their work tasks deserve and all are paid for work done, so the workers do profit from the company. The companies failure will be bad for the worker as well as the company, right?

-------------------------
I was right.

Cole no capitalist knowingly pays a worker equal to or greater than the wealth created by their labor. That's how it works, they make money by keeping a portion of the wealth created by the worker's labor.
That goes in to pocket of the capitalist who owns the "means of production" such as the plant and the tools.

If a product or service is necessary, then let it be produced in the quantity necessary to meet the needs of the population, and let the work be direct by the workers themselves and their elected leaders.

A worker NEVER "profits".

Of all the talk of people in "bubbles" some of you guys have been in the bubble so long you've lost the capacity to imagine any alternative to the current system. You accept the ups, downs, and cruelty of the rigged markets as inevitable as storm season. I'm telling you a better world is possible.

-------------------------
Capitalism is based on the ridiculous notion that you can enjoy limitless growth in a closed, finite system.

In biology, such behavior of cells is called "cancer".

Edited: 04/01/2020 at 01:22 PM by RustyTruck

He said it a long time ago. Here's an english translation.

The love of commerce at the expense of others is the root of all evil.

-------------------------
Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people.

If you set screws in a auto plant for $35 an hour, you are making a hell of a "profit," especially when you compare it to the near zero wages made by workers in places like Cuba and Venezuela who do the same job. I understand your point, but there is a huge grey area in all of it.

China was a nobody until their society developed a Middle Class. The Middle Class was achieved by a mix of capitalism and socialism.



-------------------------
I was right.

Edited: 04/01/2020 at 02:06 PM by Cole

Workers always fare better in employee owned businesses. Businesses always fare better in employee owned businesses.

-------------------------
Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people.

who says its great?